Save Flight Error

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Re: Save Flight Error

Postby Steve Waite » Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:43 pm

Any news? I've got no other reports and unable to recreate the issue here. If you can find a repeatable scenario I can set it up here...
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Re: Save Flight Error

Postby Steve Waite » Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:32 am

When we use the IF10 in-sim ALT menu item to Save the flight there's a standard SimConnect function to send the sim that causes it to save the flight files exactly the same set of files we get saved when using the FSX/P3D menu.

When we use the sim menu we have to type in a name for the flight and some text for detail if we want.

When IF invokes P3D to save it sends (via SimConnect) the name "Ideal_Flight" (or whatever we specify in the IF config) and the sim does the rest.


The files go into the Users\YOU\Docs\Sim folder:
C:\Users\YOU\Documents\Prepar3D v4 Files\Ideal_Flight.FLT

..with some other files all saved by the sim.

These files are copied by IF into the IF saves folder structure and renamed accordingly for the profile:
C:\ProgramData\Ideal Flight Professional\Flight\Saved\0_Ideal_Flight.FLT

When we load the saved flight with IF that file is copied back to the Users\YOU\Docs\Sim folder and the command line "Prepar3D.exe Ideal_Flight.FLT" is sent to the console.

With that the console process takes over and instructs P3D that there's a new flight file to load and P3D loads the flight.

When the flight is loaded the SimConnect message comes to IF that the flight started. The IF monitor starts and the weather is injected and the AI traffic is injected by IF.
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Re: Save Flight Error

Postby Steve Waite » Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:50 am

When IF attempts to copy those files, if there's any kind of hold up or problem sensed, IF backs out. Because it uses the SImConnect function, that can end unexpectedly and that will end IF too since it will most likely be affected catastrophically, in some circumstances we might see an error exception from IF or IF will close unexpectedly. There's no harm done and no corrupted files or any problems left over that way.

We don't need IF running then anyway since the sim s not functioning correctly. We have to fix the sim and then continue to use IF.

Historically if there's a problem when using IF it's the sim or the system at fault. IF simply backs out as gracefully as possible when an error condition is met, it won't send a message where Windows does it, Windows will say IF closed. We can stop the sim, restart IF and then continue with the flight. If the problem came up during the save game then there may be some files copied and not others, giving us the error when trying to start the saved flight.

What would be handy is the old savegame if we made one earlier- that's often there in the "Undo" folder
C:\ProgramData\Ideal Flight Professional\Flight\Undo

We can copy that to the "Saved" folder:
C:\ProgramData\Ideal Flight Professional\Flight\Saved

and then start IF and start the saved flight.

It's been on the cards to automate that for some time and also what been asked for is old saved slots to be made available - also been on the todo list for a long time. However it's so rarely asked for and the kind of problem you are experiencing never comes up basically.

Even so there's always a possibility that it's a problem in IF as there's a lot of work done on it as you can imagine it does a million jobs. But with stock FSX and the stock planes that's all been solid from day one.

Usually there's a way I can recreate the problem here within hours and if it's genuine it would be fixed overnight with an update made available in the New Builds section by morning - i'm not joking.
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Re: Save Flight Error

Postby Steve Waite » Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:21 pm

What I do to find problems is make a copy of the sim config, rename the files and start the sim so that it's as if just installed. Some scenery also modifies the basic set so on my systems I also have a stock copy of the sim, made just after installing, and a program that renames the structure so that I am instantly up and running with a fresh copy of any of the sims in Win 7 and Win 10.

Frankly, problems just melt away and IF continues to do the job. In effect I really only use IF, PFPX occasionally for modified routes but the standard routes and downloaded routes are fairly boring very quickly repeating. When I use scenery I just set it up when and if I want it, I don't install everything I own in any installation. As far as reliability is concerned that's the best way I've found.

I use IF every day and do anything that I find there and then in dev mode. So there's a slim chance the exe release could fail in some way due to compiler optimisation as I'm not usually using the release exe.
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Re: Save Flight Error

Postby Steve Waite » Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:33 am

Any findings?

You can save/restore at the start of the flight with no issue, and generally it's OK, yet run into a problem after a while.

There's no difference in that save/restore code after you fly a bit - it's still the same call.

It relies on the SimConnect server not being baulked by another process also and relies on the folder and files being writeable. I can demonstrate both issues here reliably cause the effect you are seeing.

Can you think of anything on the system starting up during the flight, or maybe you fly toward a certain scenery. Problem for IF is that it will not be able to work unless it can access the resources without fail.
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Re: Save Flight Error

Postby Steve Waite » Wed Jan 24, 2018 7:58 pm

Hi Joe,

So not a single problem reported with save/reloading. Got to put this down to a system anomaly - something holding a file closed or whatever.

Without anything substantial from you to go on I'm stuck to find your problems out.

Did you try the sim in stock trim with IF, the simple setup mentioned? It could be a virus checker or something blocking the iflight10.exe - who knows. If you got dlls loaded problems I've seen whereby the same dll is loaded twice has caused conflicts.

All the best
Steve
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Re: Save Flight Error

Postby Steve Waite » Sat Jan 27, 2018 8:11 pm

I take it you're not interested in being courteous enough to let me know your situation - sorry if that's the case. I've just had no reports like yours whatsoever so I'm letting you know i'm closing the enquiry. :D
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Re: Save Flight Error

Postby Steve Waite » Sun Jan 28, 2018 1:15 pm

Guys,

This is really annoying for us Ideal Flighters, because If Joe had a genuine problem it would have been great to find out what it was, perhaps employ a work around or, as I suspect, find out the erroneous program affecting the reading of the FSX flight files and work out a procedure for it. There' may even be a way to get things reliable, for example when a flight starts we can start it paused already, unpaused, or start then pause. These three ways of starting the sim can have an impact on the way some addons work -although rare and due to poor addon design. Anyway Joe unfortunately died or got prematurely annoyed before we got far enough to help him out with that.

Since there's been very little done to that part of IF in quite a few years, there's also the possibility of something having come out in the meantime to cause problems and effect the operation of Ideal Flight - it's a long shot but anything can happen. I'll soon know about it, many thousands of IF10s and IFPros are out there now and next to no reports of problems.

Got an email last night describing IF0 as a reliable program that they "could not do without". I totally agree - I can't run the sim without IF, I probably wouldn't be flight simming without IF10 or IFPro. That's my desert island disk.

Maybe Joe died, or maybe he didn't appreciate the way problems are resolved and the way addons have to
co-exist.

Maybe he felt I could problem solve his system with next to no input from him - I don't even know what version FSX or IF he's using or what or if any addons are involved. This is especially important for IF since it's got a finger in so many pies it's going to find that problem in your system - it's not a problem in IF and that's just the way it is. Look at the number of guys use IF provided ideas and desires fro IF and along the years got exactly what they wanted.

So it's annoying to think a problem may be out there so we have to wait and see.

So guys, if you got a problem, let me know the version of IF, the version of the sim, the addons you are using, maybe something about the system, even browser choice can make a difference with security issues.

Don't give up like Joe at least.
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Re: Save Flight Error

Postby Steve Waite » Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:25 pm

For the purpose of this thread, obviously Joe's backed out of it but that's entirely irrelevant...Run tests with all IF versions for hours saving and restoring - nothing happened other than the flights continued normally. Got £4000 of addons, I know what they all do, don't worry.

I can run a fake addon process that goes into an error condition that holds open certain files or simconnect and IF backs out with a windows message. It depends on exactly what happens but IF won't continue and possibly make erroneous changes to the profile. If your system has a fault like that there's nothing I can do to fix it. If that's happened to you, I'm very sorry but it's not my problem and I'm not making IF to upset you.
:mrgreen:
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Re: Save Flight Error

Postby Steve Waite » Tue Feb 27, 2018 12:14 pm

We found a situation whereby it is possible a reloaded saved flight did not keep the gear up, even though the gear is up in the .FLT file. So we restored a saved flight and got the gear down, part of the gear failure code is involved. If we were flying a fixed gear aircraft we didn't see it. That's fixed in the next preview build. It came about due to a work-around for P3D upsetting an inherited object. I'm not sure if Joe's problem is somehow related to that although does not look possible internally.

Also in the next update I'm including some long overdue improvements to the interface.
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